repair or replace goodman hvac system??

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Carol Scheible - 28 Jul 2004 19:56 GMT

Hi,

My downstairs AC is not cooling my 6 year old house (tho, the fan does
work). I had two companies come out an look at the unit. There is oil
all over the concrete pad.

The first guy said that the coil was leaking and needed replacing. He also
said that since I let it run wtihout oil, the compressor was also probably
shot. He gave an estimate of $1200 for the coil and $1400 for the
compressor.

The second guy said that just the compressor was shot. The cost to fix is
$1500.

Both of them said that the unit was a Goodman, and that it was such a low
quality unit that it's not worth fixing. They both said the expected life
of that quality unit is about 10 years, and that other parts are likely to
fail soon too, so I'd be wasting my money.

I got an estimate for a new Trane unit, which would run me about $5000.

What should I do? Are they both just trying to get me to buy a new unit?

Signature

Thanks,
Carol Scheible
web@sitepublish.com

Reply to this Message

SQLit - 28 Jul 2004 20:18 GMT

> Hi,
>
[quoted text clipped - 18 lines]
>
> What should I do? Are they both just trying to get me to buy a new unit?

6 years old and crapping that is about right for an reciprocal compressor
any manufacture.
Your old Goodman is probably a 10 seer. That is the minimum allowed by the
feds today.
first how long do you plan to stay in the new home? If your not going to
stay 5 + years then fix the old one. Probably
http://198.147.238.24/ac_calc/default.asp
This site will allow you to "play what if" Make sure you plug in the fuel
costs.

If there is oil on the pad the compressor is shot. Now comes the hard part
was the freon burnt or damaged in any way? Hard to know unless you pull out
the charge and test it. Unless you can smell it. If it was burned or
damaged then you need an new indoor coil. Cheaper to buy an new one than to
try to clean the old one. Ask before you pay for something that is not
needed. If the charge was lost then the indoor coil might be ok.

What seer were they quoting? I got a quote for $5400.00 for a Trane 14 seer
with VFD fan coil. Using the above page, since I am not staying here more
than 5 years, I decided that $326 a year was not enough to save. I
declined.

Manufactures all make top of the line and acceptable units. Scroll
compressors last longer and are quieter also more money.

The installer is more important than the brand name. Get at least 3 bids
for a new unit and or fixing the old one. Ask questions
I hope this helps.

Reply to this Message

Carol Scheible - 28 Jul 2004 21:06 GMT

Hi,

Thanks for the reply!

> 6 years old and crapping that is about right for an reciprocal compressor
> any manufacture.

It seems like an hvac system should last 15-20 years.

> Your old Goodman is probably a 10 seer. That is the minimum allowed by the
> feds today.

It's a PGB024075-1 (a dual furnace and AC system), which I looked up on the
internet as a 10 SEER.

> first how long do you plan to stay in the new home?
> http://198.147.238.24/ac_calc/default.asp

For at least 8 years. That site said I would save $76 per year on energy
costs. Certainly not worth paying $5000 for a new system, IMO. What would
be worth paying for the new system is knowing that the old system would
totally crap out next year despite getting a new compressor. (need a
crystal ball!)

> If there is oil on the pad the compressor is shot. Now comes the hard part
> was the freon burnt or damaged in any way? Hard to know unless you pull out
> the charge and test it. Unless you can smell it. If it was burned or
> damaged then you need an new indoor coil. Cheaper to buy an new one than to
> try to clean the old one. Ask before you pay for something that is not
> needed. If the charge was lost then the indoor coil might be ok.

Here's what the guys wrote on the tickets:

Repair Guy #1:
Diagnosis: found condensor coil clogged up + coil is leaking. need to
replace condensor coil. unit also operating w/ no freon in system...damage
to compressor is likely.
Recommendation: $1250 for cond coil replacement. Plus possibly $1400 for
compressor.

Repair Guy #2:
Diagnosis: found compressor w/blown out terminal, oil charge blown on lower
1/6th of condensor coil, acid smell.
Recommendation: Replace unit 1st option. 2nd option: Replace compressor,
install suc. line prien(?) chem clean coil. Note other problems may exist.

>> I got an estimate for a new Trane unit, which would run me about $5000.

> What seer were they quoting? I got a quote for $5400.00 for a Trane 14 seer

I can choose $4596 for 12 SEER unit and $5396 for a 14 SEER unit.

> The installer is more important than the brand name. Get at least 3 bids
> for a new unit and or fixing the old one.

Trouble is, the two companies that came out each charged me $85 for the
service call. I don't want to pay for another dang estimate for fixing it!

Thanks for your advice!

Carol

Reply to this Message

udarrell - 28 Jul 2004 22:05 GMT

>Hi,
>
[quoted text clipped - 88 lines]
>Carol
>

Run capacitors are also filled with oil and can on rare occasion
rupture. I saw this happen and the techs condemned the compressor, which
ran perfectly when I replaced the run capacitor. However, the home owner
had me put a new higher efficiency condensing unit in anyway.

Goodman equipment, when properly installed can last as long as the
higher priced equipment. I don't believe in knocking equipment.

<A HREF="http://www.udarrell.com/my_pages2.htm#MY_AIR_CONDITIONING_PAGES">

Darrell udarrell

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Empowerment Communications -
Economic and Political Solutions Not Terrorism and Wars -
http://www.udarrell.com/my_pages2.htm

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Mike Bittel - 29 Jul 2004 11:40 GMT

$5k seems pretty high even for a trane. I just got three quotes to do a
standard change-out for a 10-Seer 3-Ton unit:

Trane Dealer: $2000
Lennox Dealer: $1250
Rheem Dealer: $1300

Reply to this Message

Carol Scheible - 29 Jul 2004 13:58 GMT

> $5k seems pretty high even for a trane. I just got three quotes to do a
> standard change-out for a 10-Seer 3-Ton unit:

It's a dual unit which also includes a gas furnace....perhaps that would
explain the
added cost ?? I haven't yet gotten a second quote on a new system.

Reply to this Message

~KJPRO~ - 29 Jul 2004 18:00 GMT

> $5k seems pretty high even for a trane. I just got three quotes to do a
> standard change-out for a 10-Seer 3-Ton unit:
>
> Trane Dealer: $2000
> Lennox Dealer: $1250
> Rheem Dealer: $1300

You're not comparing apple's against apple's.....

He received two proposals....

One 12 SEER (complete package unit) for 4596.

&

One 14 SEER (complete package unit) for 5396.

And by your numbers, I'd say those are prices for just the condensing unit.
Which if it is, the only one that is close to being priced right is the
Trane dealer.

The thing you have to ask yourself, is what are the cheaper companies NOT
doing to be able to do it for such a low price.
Things work hand in hand normally, quality cost money, no way around it.

~kjpro~

Reply to this Message

Greg O - 29 Jul 2004 00:48 GMT

> Hi,
>
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> shot. He gave an estimate of $1200 for the coil and $1400 for the
> compressor.

You should be able to replace the outdoor unit only, price depends on lablor
in your area, but we would install a new condensing unit for less than
$1800. If you repair the old unit, the warranty will most likely be 90 days,
if you replace it you should get a full manufacturers warranty, sometimes up
to ten years, depending on the manufacturer.
The coil is possibly under warranty, if you find a dealer that will screw
with it. You may still need to pay labor for the repair. I really would not
worry about the compressor, it can be tested to get a guess on condition.
Add a bit of oil with the new coil, and it should be ok.
If you unable to get warranty repair, repalace the whole unit.
Greg
Greg

Reply to this Message

~KJPRO~ - 29 Jul 2004 08:21 GMT

> > Hi,
> >
[quoted text clipped - 20 lines]
> Greg
> Greg

Greg,

After reading the tech's ticket descriptions and knowing Goodman
products.....

I'd have to say that the first company is a con-artist. And the second
company diagnosed the unit properly. As to the pins being blown out, with
oil all over the place. (as this is common with Goodman's)

I personally wouldn't bother fixing the unit, install a new condenser at a
minimum. If you have the funds, go with a complete new system, line set and
all. As the refrigerate/oil residue in the old line set could contaminate
the new system.

Good Luck,
~kjpro~

Reply to this Message

Carol Scheible - 12 Aug 2004 15:44 GMT

Hi All,

Just thought I'd post an update. We decided to repair the unit rather than
replace it with a new one. We hired Repair Guy #2 and he replaced the
compressor and charged us $1500 like the estimate said. The air conditioner
has been working great for 10 days now. (knocking on wood). Repair Guy #2
was ARS (formerly Tilman Heating and Air) in Durham, NC.

We figured that if a new system costs $5000 and has a 10 year warrantee,
then that equates to $500 per year. So, if repairing this old unit buys us
3 more years of life, than that'll be worth it. My husband can repair
things that don't involve the compressed lines or freon, so as long as the
condensor doesn't give out, we should be good to make any other repairs
ourselves. Hopefully, we'll get more than 3 more years out of it!

Thanks alot for the advice!

Signature

HTH,
Carol Scheible
web@sitepublish.com

"Carol Scheible" <zlp@maps.on> wrote in message news:...

> Hi,
>
> Thanks for the reply!
>
> > 6 years old and crapping that is about right for an reciprocal

compressor

> > any manufacture.
>
> It seems like an hvac system should last 15-20 years.
>
> > Your old Goodman is probably a 10 seer. That is the minimum allowed by

the

> > feds today.
>
> It's a PGB024075-1 (a dual furnace and AC system), which I looked up on

the

> internet as a 10 SEER.
>
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> For at least 8 years. That site said I would save $76 per year on energy
> costs. Certainly not worth paying $5000 for a new system, IMO. What

would

> be worth paying for the new system is knowing that the old system would
> totally crap out next year despite getting a new compressor. (need a
[quoted text clipped - 21 lines]
> Repair Guy #2:
> Diagnosis: found compressor w/blown out terminal, oil charge blown on

lower

> 1/6th of condensor coil, acid smell.
> Recommendation: Replace unit 1st option. 2nd option: Replace

compressor,

> install suc. line prien(?) chem clean coil. Note other problems may

exist.

> >> I got an estimate for a new Trane unit, which would run me about $5000.
>
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
> > The installer is more important than the brand name. Get at least 3

bids

> > for a new unit and or fixing the old one.
>
> Trouble is, the two companies that came out each charged me $85 for the
> service call. I don't want to pay for another dang estimate for fixing

it!

> Thanks for your advice!
>
> Carol

Reply to this Message

Homeowner Forum / Repair / August 2004

repair or replace goodman hvac system??